Testing Commercial SL50 Oxy Hydrogen Generator on Dodge Sprinter

OK, beside lower engine temperature, Aubrey observed another quanlitative (not quantitative yet) result yesterday…

He backed off our Dodge Sprinter into the bay door to load stuff - half of the vehicle body was inside the bay. After shutting down the engine, he noticed immediately that the terrible smell that always comes from a diesel vehicle’s exhaust pipe was not there - he could not smell it.

Thinking that the smell might be small for a hot engine, he smelled it again after finishing loading the van and starting the engine again after 15 minutes. Still, no smell could be detected. Note that he was not sick with cold or anything. So we think it worths reporting here.

Lastly, after driving the cargo van for three days for 239 KM (according the mileage meter reading), the tank is only 1/4 empty. According to 2006 Dodge Sprinter specifications:

http://autobuyguide.com/2006/12-aut/dodge/sprinter-2500/specifications/

The full tank takes 26.4 gallon diesel which equals to about 100 liters. 1/4 of the full tank is 25 liters. This gives 10.46 liters/100KM fuel consumption. Using our average 100KM fuel consumption of 12.44 liters in the past (see above), the estimated saving is 16% - the final quantitative saving may be higher but we have to wait and see. When we get the actual figure, we will post it here.

This is old technology with a new name. Water vapor injection has been around for the past 25 years or more.

This is great! I sure hope that we are able to drive around in an all water vehicle soon! I know Denny Klein has been working on His car and already has a welder that is fueled by water. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKM4pb9Oxrg this is a link to the youtube video with the info on it for anyone interested. I am hoping that soon he will have his process available for all of us. here is another website to look at that i just found: http://www.hytechapps.com/ this is Denny Klein’s website.

Having battled my 05 Sprinter’s fuel system while running WVO, I’ve learned there is possitive pressure where I see in photo the line going in and sealed. On my truck it is 17 to 30 psi in that tube and that would have Large Effect on your experiment. I know nothing about HHO, though I want to learn, but I BELIEVE moving that line over to the air filter box would GREATLY improve results.

This latest testing result for our 2006 Dodge Sprinter’s fuel consumption for highway driving, 13.66 L/100KM (17.22 MPG), shows that fuel burning efficiency does degrade with time. During the first year of its use, 13.10 L/100KM was the highest recorded fuel consumption for city/highway driving - we did not separate the two driving conditions in the past and we just fill up the tank and drive the vehicle - within the city and on the highway - and then fill up the tank again. But should the degrading this high?

Another possibility is that, like Bill pointed out, we might not have sealed the area where HHO gas is introduced to the engine if the pressure at the point is indeed positive rather than negative (vacuum). Any leaking in the air intake hose would degrade fuel burning efficiency because of not enough oxygen is supplied, especial when the demand for air is huge in the case of highway driving. We definitely need to do something about it. Sealing a pressured line from outside is harder than sealing a vacuum line. Maybe we need to find out where the pressure is negative first.

Thank you again Bill for your tip!

Bill, you are right, I have not adjusted the exhaust O2 sensor yet. I understand that there are two ways to do it: (1) purchasing an Electronic Fuel Injection Enhancer (EFIE) or (2) using an adapter to make the O2 sensor less sensitive. I plan to do one of these after finding a right spot to feed the HHO gas (enough vacuum pressure to suck it in rather than push it out).

Also, I plan to switch to a home-made device to do the test because (1) the commercial SL50 unit is a bit too big for our Sprinter - the only place it fits is near the engine which makes the device hot and (2) we find that the home-made device we assembled according to detailed instructions sold here appears to produce more HHO gas using less current. We would like to test the SL50 unit on our Toyota Sienna once we find a good mechanic to help us install it as Toyota looks more complex than Sprinter as far as the air intake manifold is concerned.

Mass Air Flow sensor? Hmmm… I do not know anything about it. Intercooler? I guess we need to find a good mechanic to address these issues. One thing I know is that we are not producing a lot of HHO gas to improve fuel burning efficiency. The HHO gas produced may be only 5% of the total air needed to run the engine.

If you know anything about these, please let us know.

On dino diesel I get 20 mpg. I always start the truck on dino until it warms up to 180 deg. then switch to oil and get about 17 mpg. My measuring of the oil is inaccurate since I don’t have a flow meter.

I’m in Florida, and the warmer weather makes it easier to keep the oil warm eough to flow through filters. Then the trucks antifreeze heats the oil to 180 before injecting into the engine.

My van is the Super High Cab 158 wb, 2500. It’s the biggest they made until 07 and most folks report 20 mpg is better than they get with same van. Luck, I guess, since I KNOW it’s not my driving habbits. I’m a lead-foot.

I was thinking… Since the HHO generator puts out a constant amount. Wouldn’t it be be logical to have one unit come on with the truck. Then have another unit to turn on manually when reaching highway speeds or other high fuel demand. How many units would it take to overload my 200 amp alternator?

My reading indicates HHO is HUGE for folks who sit in traffic for hours. Not so much for us who run open roads. Also, we are not producing enough Hydrgen to produce the BTU’s that support the difference in mileage. So it MUST be a better MIX of air/fuel (by means of better air, not better carb). Thus posses the question, “Will it have similar effects on waste oil or even Biodiesel?” I picture it as mixing elements to get the biggest explosion, rather than adding hydrogen. Adding more “sugar” won’t always “sweeten” the recipe.

Do you feel you “got your moneies worth” from the instructions? I know a guy who used to sell a roach killer. Guaranteed to kill every roach in your house… but what the ad didn’t tell you is, you had to get each roach on the block of wood. Yeah, a scam. All good scams are built on a truely good idea, then far more effort spent on marketing than ever spent on developing the idea.
I’m a sceptical lead-foot!
B

Thank you, Bill, for the valuable information.

Concerning your question of the possibility of using two or more units for highway driving, it should not have any problem. The recommended current for the commercial SL50 unit is 15 amps. I set it at about 10 amps by adjusting the amount of electrolyte (KOH) I put in. Ozzie Freedom, the promoter of the water4gas home-made device, uses up to 6 units connected in series. His instructions also include a plan to build a MAP sensor for city or highway driving options.

As far as I know, there are two ways of using hydrogen from water electrolysis: (1) use it as a supplemental fuel as in my case and (2) use it as the only fuel to power the engine. For the latter, enough HHO has to be produced with a non-conventional way to break the water molecules as demonstrated by Stan Meyers’ water car and Joe cells. What is practical and feasible now is using hydrogen as the supplemental fuel.

HHO should have similar effect for waste oil, biodiesel, or any other fuels as hydrogen burns the cleanest and hottest. The idea of using hydrogen as a supplemental fuel is to take advantage of these benefits to improve the burning efficiency of all other fuels.

Do I get the money worth from the instructions? Not for the commercial SL50 unit. The instructions were poorly produced and we have to figure it ourselves how to install it. In contrast, Ozzie Freedom’s ebooks are value packed and detailed to every aspect.

Thank you again for the valuable information regarding your advice of not installing the HHO feed before the air turbo. Now since the air intake manifold has a positive pressure rather than negative, I have to find a better way to seal the area where I feed HHO into the manifold. Initially I used silicon glue to do it - kind of silly as you can see from the second and third pictures above. Then I used a duct tape to wrap around the area thinking it was vacuum inside. Since it is not vacuum, I have to do something to make sure there is no leaking whatsoever around that area.

Also, I may need to insert a one-way air check valve in the HHO feed line to prevent the pressured air from entering the bubbler jar but still allow HHO to be pushed into the air intake manifold when the HHO pressure accumulates in the jar to be equal to or greater than that of the air.

By the way, Bill, I went to your website and found about you and the picture of your white 2005 Sprinter. Your Sprinter is 158 inch wheel base as you mentioned. Mine is 144 wheel base. So you run WVO on your Sprinter? You must have separate tanks for diesel and WVO, right? Can you find a space for the WVO tank?

I had room for a tank under the van, in front of the spare tire. I’m guessing that space is not there on shorter wheel base. It was too small and dificult to fill, so I removed it and now use a 32 gal plastic barrel standing inside, near the rear door. Factory tank is still for dino.

About a check valve… As long as your box doesn’t leak, and you don’t open it to refill while the turbo is engaged… the air can’t flow that direction. It will pressurise, so a brief halt or back-up of air will happen, but a check valve would only hold that back flow from giong into the box. Basically, holding the door shut until the pressure of building gas meets that of the intake manifold, and HHO operation reumes.

As I see it: a puff of fresh air getting into the box will dilute your Brown’s gas, but equalize pressure quickly and continue flow to the engine almost immediately. Where a check valve would close a door, halting Brown’s gas until the generated gas reaches pressure equal to the manifold. Then HHO flow to the engine would resume. Either way, the same pressure will be reached inside the box, and the same amount of Brown’s gas will be produced and burned. The first method, a slightly lesser concentration of HHO for a moment. The second always the same concentration, but shut-off a moment while pressure equalizes.

For a better sealed input. I’m visualizing an elbow, barbed on one side, and threaded on the other, maybe brass. Cut a hole in the hose large enough for the threaded end and insert from inside the hose, with the barbed side inside, pointing the direction of flow.Tightening a nut onto the threaded end poking out of the hose should seal nicely. You may need some washers and a thin nut to get a good seal and still have enough thread left to screw on your HHO plumbing. But I don’t see any reason for this to be a small elbow… GO BIG!

With my 6300 mile road trip complete… I’m ready to add this to my truck. I gather you recomend I build one instead of buy it? You didn’t happen to build two while you were at it??? :o)

Bill

316L grade stainless steel wire… I’m on it! Found 100′ of .032 diameter on eBay. I’m finding out if they will ship it to you when I buy it. Most eBay sales will ship only to addresses confirmed same as credit card bill. Also there is a kit with pre-cut and pre-drilled plexiglass for making the Water4Gas design.
I found something else of interest, a “Joe Cell”. It is cylinders of 316L inside eachother.
I should probably go ahead and buy the instructions, but then I’d have to read them and sort out the facts as you have already done specifically for your Sprinter.
I’ll email you through the contact page, so you can give an address to ship the wire to. Or a couple Joe Cells if you think that would be better.
Bill

The wire I ordered arrived today. I have not heard from you, maybe the spam filters. I’d be glad to send some wire to you and hear your results. I couldn’t wait for the wire, so I started with some old junk I’ve collected. Making .5 l/m on 24 SS fender washers, 2.5 in. diam. in a water filter housing. I’m hesitant to put it in my Sprinter until I understand the O2 sensor situation better. Learning Waste Veg Oil was an expensive experience. About to break even now, and will profit fast with diesel rising above $4/gal. Not so much to gain in doubling the miles per gallon of veg oil…. :o) It’s already close to free.
B

OK, it took me a weekend to get the home-made HHO generator installed, re-built and reinstalled according to the ebook I got from http://www.water4gas.ca - the main reason for this prolonged process was because I set the operating current to be around 10 amps, rather than 5 amps or less as recommended. 10 amp setting was for the commercial device and it made the home-made cell too hot with this setting.

Since this is the first test with the home-made device, I will start a new post for it. See you in a minute.

OK, here is the test result for the home-made device.

I have a 1998 toyota camry and had installed the water4gas according to spec with the map sensor and by not disconnecting but bypassing the O2 sensors of which there are 2. So far i have not noticed any increase in mileage but the car runs smoother.Any suggestions from here?

The posting process dropped my reference to the SaveFuel website. (where i said “SL50 numbers from”)

I’ll try slightly reformatting it: http://www.savefuel.ca/hydrogen/smallproducts.php?id=carproducts

and, verbally, that was http://www.savefuel.ca and chase down the “small products” links.

If you’d like a better idea of what your Sprinter is doing, i recommend a ScanGauge … it reads out fuel consumption, engine load, and a dozen or so other handy chunks of data … as you drive (it also speaks metric).

Using it as a guide, you can increase your in-city mileage by quite a bit (i’ve worked my Sprinter up to 20 mpg from 16… a major improvement is popping into neutral at traffic lights… that can lower idling fuel consumption by 20%). The ScanGauge simply plugs into the OBD-II connector near your left knee.

have fun
–dick

I have not yet built a Joe Cell, and put aside my truck, since it works well on veggie oil now, in favor of helping a few locals work on their HHO systems. We seem to have hit a wall at .5 lpm and despite bigger plates, cross hatch sanding, and many trials with errors, still getting just .5 lpm. I’m going to apply my own advice this week and try larger wires. Perhaps our amp meters are restricting?

One of the trucks I’m working on has NO O2 sensors to deal with. However, our Sprinters do. Looking under the hood, there is a large heat shield on the passenger’s side. The wire harness clipped to that goes to your O2 sensor. It is the only one.

I am thrilled to hear your results, and quite surprised to hear the homemade did so well. I abandoned wire before UPS delivered it, now will rethink that decision.

Hi…

> Dick, HHO is used to make the burning of diesel more efficient. We are not using it to replace diesel or gasoline in our case. You can think HHO as fuel booster/reformer rather than fuel replacement.

You are correct that i did not approach it with that in mind… thanks for the correction/insight.
I’ll go digging for more information on that aspect.

For Bill, questioning any “authority” is good, but i do prefer citations to physics or chemistry references/publications if at all possible. If the HHO is acting as a catalyst (”reformer”), that indeed leads us into areas where “how it works” is still vastly unexplored. I have little doubt that the near future will include the discovery/creation of (for example) C60 “buckyballs” with entrapped metal atoms which greatly catalyze otherwise lethargic (or incomplete) chemical reactions.

One reason i went -into- such detail in my “math” posting is so that my thought processes and methods -were- fully transparent and open to criticism.

That’s true scientific method: present a theory (replacement of fuel by HHO), do the math, make predictions and suggest methods of refutation.
Use experiment to try and invalidate the predictions. Confirmation of predictions is reassuring, but not “proof”.

The bumblebee analogy is a good one. The idea/myth they couldn’t fly was apparently based upon a simplistic application of a fixed-wing model in 1934. An adequate math (Navier-Stokes) had been worked out in the early 1800’s, just not applied in that case. In the 1960s vortex effects were factored in and pretty much the full aerodynamic portion of the puzzle was resolved.
That ‘only’ left the biologic question of “how do they beat their wings so -quickly-?”

I may well add an HHO generator to my Sprinter (which does have a ScanGauge). The ScanGauge also lets us see the temperature (ambient to about 80F over ambient) and air pressure (varies between 1 (no boost) and 2 atmospheres) -after- the turbocharger, so the effects of (or upon) HHO injection placement might be better understood.

have fun (that’s not sarcasm, it’s an honest wish)
–dick

If you’d like an example of a happy HHO Sprinter owner who -does- have a ScanGauge which lets him see the -instantaneous- effect of turning it on/off enroute, visit:
http://www.sprinter-source.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1294

I should warn you of at least two things: some of the thread-posters are quite critical of the topic, and some of the advocate’s numbers are really weird.
For example, he has an SL25, yet says it draws 23 amps? That’s more than twice the current for half the output of FuelSaving’s.
(a high KOH load could account for, though)

Jacques, there is only one big hose for the air intake. The other one you see (smaller) is for coolant.

Dick, I feel that a high current such as 23 amps may give a high instant MPG because of huge amount of HHO production, but since it draws more power from the battery, the long-term net result may be less saving for the fuel. There’s got a plateau as to how much fuel saving you can achieve simply by increasing the current.

Don, could explain why I must inject HHO before turbo?

I measured the pressure right before the air intake manifold (where I injected HHO) and found out it was negative (some vacuum) when the van was idling. Maybe like Dick mentioned somewhere, at that time the turbo was not on and if the turbo were on it should have a positive pressure. So, if the turbo is OFF, HHO is easier to be sucked into the eninge; when the turbo is ON, less HHO can be injected into the engine. Don, is it why you say HHO must be injected before the turbo so that HHO is kind of temporarily stored/diffused in the long air hose when the turbo is OFF and then pressured together with air when the turbo is ON so that more HHO can be injected when the engine needs more air and fuel? Sounds reasonable. OK, my concern is how to feed HHO right after the air filter. The hose there is made of thinner rubber. Maybe I should use the soft vinyl tubing rather than a thick and heavy plumbing hose to do that.

Don, I think you are right in saying that I must use EFIE. When I have time I will purchase one from here and test it. I believe using EFIE will give me better fuel saving than what I got without it (16% with SL50 and 14% with my home-made device).

My wife has just been diagnosed with breast cancer and gone through the operation suggested by the doctor. I need to be with her more and also take care of our business at the same time. I can only use a few hours in the weekend for the testing. Please understand if I am slower than you expect.

Hi, I’ve been looking into this HHO technology since gas prices are going outrageously high here in Hawaii. According to my knowledge about turbo’s (we installed several of them and superchargers) it is correct to install it after the air cleaner since it will always have a vacuum there regardless of boost. If you install it after the Turbo then it is actually not helping during boost. According to your pic your injecting the HHO after the mass air meter so I don’t see how it would damage it. The wires right in front of the area you sealed is connected to the Mass air flow sensor. From what I know your gas savings is awesome since I would think that your O2 is reading lean and injecting more gas into the engine. I am surprised that the gas mileage is not worse..lol. Did you get new reading with it installed before the turbo???…Another question I have is that since you didn’t calibrate the O2 senser..did you notice any power increase or decrease???..

Thank you Arden about the potential presence of a hot wire in the mass air meter (I assumed you mean the Mass Air Flow - MAF - sensor in Sprinter). As you can see, I feed HHO after the filter and the mass flow sensor and HHO is sucked in so the chance of HHO diffusing back to the mass flow sensor is slim. But I will check it out with the dealer anyway just to make sure.

About your questions… No I have not got any reading yet after I injected HHO before the turbo. I am going to fill the fuel tank to the rim again and check it out today. I expect to see a bigger saving on fuel - will see.

To your second question, yes I do feel an increase in power after using HHO generator. The engine sounds running smoother. But that’s all feeling - I do plan to purchase ScanGauge II as Dick suggested so I can measure what I feel in numbers

OK, quick report on fuel consumption after I injected HHO before the turbo: 10.9 L/100KM after driving for 337KM (fuel consumed is 36.743L). Note that this is Calgary city driving and the saving is as good as highway driving when HHO is injected after the turbo. Note also that during earlier tests, the air induction hose might not be sealed properly as I heard a whistling sound when the engine speed was more than 2500 RMP. Now for this test, I have taken some extra care to seal completely the two holes left by earlier test. I will do another highway comparison test in a short future.

On the HHO versus the “hot wire” MAF sensor issue: once the HHO is added to the main airstream, the percentage of hydrogen to -total- oxygen drops way way below the 4% required to be explosive. (at 2000 rpm, the 1 liter per minute of the HHO is about 1/3000th, or 0.03%, of the total volume).

The HHO still -would- be an explosion problem if it were allowed to build up in the intake plumbing with the engine not rotating.

———-
p.s. to Don: yesterday i was focusing my “tunnel vision” on my first operating plate stack merrily generating HHO. I was investigating serial cells (visible effects), electrolyte concentration and inter-plate matting (if it works for AGM batteries, why not for electrolyzers?). “Questioning” and analysis is quite different from “naysaying”.

p.s. to Bill: Please realize that this was the first *user* hydroxyl site i have visited (other than vendors’ sites)… so i was not *aware* of the “thousands” of users, let alone accusing them of “lying”. Instead of histrionics, references to other user sites (such as i provided to SaveFuel) would be far more helpful.

p.s. to SaveFuel: my sympathies to your wife and yourself during this difficult time… my brother’s wife was also diagnosed with breast cancer at the start of the year, but surgery and chemo seem to have caught it all. Good luck.

OK, someone on the Sprinter-Source forum told me the detached hose in the above picture is indeed PCV - not EGR (exhaust-gas recirculation) as was thought before.

Now I have good news and bad news. First the good news - I have received the ScanGauge II I ordered. Here is a picture of it taken while I was using it this morning:

The upper left corner displays the instantaneous fuel consumption in liter per hundred kilometers (LHK) - 8.0LHK (8.0 L/100KM) at the moment the above picture was taken. After reading ScanGauge II Installation and Operation manual, I figured out a way to display a customized Current Trip Economy (CTE) as a gauge on the top right corner - before this it displayed MAP (manifold absolute pressure). This way I could do a few tests driving the same route and comparing the average (instead of the ever changing instantaneous) fuel economy for each trip - the trip average economy was displayed right there at the trip end. I picked a fixed route that was 20.7KM long - measured by the odometer on my van. This fixed route consists uphill, downhill, playground, and a short highway zones. I drove on purpose at these two speeds use the cruise control: 60 KM/H and 80 KM/H wherever allowed and tried to be consistent for each trip. Now here are the results…

This is what I called the bad news - injecting HHO appeared to have no effect or even reverse effect on fuel saving! This is refreshing as it indicates that I must do something to adjust oxygen sensor and even mass air flow (MAF) sensor. During the tests I found that the place I inject HHO does not have much vacuum suction - I am using an adjusted dripper as air inlet suggested by Ozzie of Water4Gas so that bubbles should be seen when the suction is enough with the HHO production turned off - I did not see any bubbling when HHO was turned off. OK, Let’s comment on the tests…

Tests 1 to 6 were made using a cell current of 6.7A measured at the end of the tests.

“Feed Removed” in tests 2 and 3 means that I removed the hard plastic tubing (slipped into the air intake hose after the MAF sensor and before the turbo) completely and tightened the hose clamp to change the vehicle to its pre-installation condition - two tests were made for this to make sure the results were valid and consistent. All later tests (4 through 8 ) were made by re-installing the tubing.

“ON (direct)” in test 6 means that I bypassed the bubbler and inject HHO directly from the electrolyzer - no difference from the result of using the bubbler.

Tests 7 and 8 indicate that a higher cell current (10.6 vs 6.7A) might have a negative effect on fuel economy (without dealing with O2 and MAF sensors). This could mean that (1) a higher current puts the vehicle on higher load and hence worse economy and (2) a higher current forces the vehicle computer to give a wrong signal to allow more fuel fed into the engine than needed.

Note that fuel volume (in liters) has not been calibrated yet as this was the first tank after I got ScanGauge II. This means results reported here should not be directly compared to our previous results without fuel volume calibration being done next - plan to do it on Monday (July 21, 2008). Note also that previous comparison results were mainly obtained for highway driving only where the speed was set at 120KM/H. I will do a test on highway only with my ScanGauge II as my aid to see if the result ScanGauge II records will agree with my previous tests.

Updated on July 23, 2008 - OK I filled up the tank again after getting my ScanGauge II and indeed the fuel volume appeared smaller than what really was. I added 58.55 liters of diesel while my ScanGauge II said only 55.21 liters of fuel consumed between the first and this filling. So the correction factor is -5.7% for my 2006 Dodge Sprinter 2500 cargo van. This means that I need to adjust the above test result by multiplying each CTE reading by 1.057 - here are the calibrated readings:

Other things you can explore with the ScanGauge:
(a) if you encounter a goodly number of traffic lights in your in-city driving, try putting it into neutral while you’re waiting. I can achieve a 20% “mileage” improvement (16 to 20mpg) by doing this, since the engine isn’t wasting energy exercising the torque converter (an automatic’s “clutch”) when stopped. RPMs won’t change, LPH will.
(b) you can bring up the “LOD” (Load) display, and cycle your electrolyzer on and off. If it is dragging down the engine, it should show by the change in load.
(c) if you -do- reprogram the ScanGauge to show the O2 sensors, then you should be able to -see- if having the booster on really changes their response.

good luck
–dick

OK, following a suggestion made by mgjessop at sprinter-source forum, I connected my two cells (SL50 and my home-built) in series. Now the operating current has decreased to only 2.7A (both cells operating current are roughly 10A measured separately before being connected in series). This small 2.7A cell current does not put too much load on engine - LOD measured by ScanGauge II just increases to 29 from 28 with HHO production ON while horsepower (HPD) increases from 2.4 to 2.5

Will test with city driving with these two cells hooked up together and calibrated ScanGauge II. Here are two pictures taken after hooking up the two cells:

The hose you’re looking at is the CCV (Crankcase Ventilation) hose… it connects the “air space” inside the crankcase to the intake of the turbo. At the base of the hose is a small electrical connection. WARNING: that is a HEATER to warm the CCV gases before adding them to the intake air.

I’ve posted a set of pictures from the Sprinter parts manual and service manual to the sprinter-forum thread you started with the hose and PCV photos.

The EGR (Exhaust Gas Circulation) system is much weirder, and you don’t want to touch it… it connects directly to the intake manifold (after the turbo) and its contribution to the intake air volume is very dynamically controlled by the ECM (engine control module). It contributes between zero to 35% of the total volume of gases ingested by the engine. If the O2 sensor thinks there’s “too much” oxygen (under partial load) the Sprinter does not increase fuel injection, instead it increases the EGR contribution to the intake volume, which displaces fresh air, which thereby lowers the oxygen delivered into the cylinders.
This means you probably do not need an EFIE or other Oxygen sensor “fooler”.

If you’d like the full Service Manual description of how the ECM “thinks”, i can either post it here, or am happy to send it along offline.

have fun
-dick

Hi…

I’ve sent along the notes on the ECM.

As for where to add the hydrogen, i think your choice (just after the air cleaner) is very good.

For my own purposes, i was planning on feeding a hose in through the exterior vents just before the air cleaner, merely to avoid having to make any modifications of the Sprinter’s “plumbing”.

Don’t worry about lack of “sucking”, since you -are- where the Sprinter is inhaling. Whatever you put there -will- end up in the cylinders.

Adding a definite vacuum to the boosters will not increase their useful hydroxy output.. that’s solely dictated by the energy you’re passing through the electrolyte. In fact, put too much of a vacuum on the boosters and you’ll significantly lower their boiling points, releasing steam into the system.

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Water_vapor_pressure_graph.jpg
At a half atmosphere water boils at about 75C (167F), a temperature many boosters achieve.
(the electrolyte will -raise- the boiling point, but it’s still something to avoid)

Something i rarely (if ever) see on booster systems is a check valve between the booster and the outside air, to allow plain air -in- to the booster when it is off and cooling down from a run. We’ve all read of boosters (on this site!) which have sucked their bubblers’ fluid back into the cells. A venting system would avoid that.
So the check valves would block HHO from escaping to the air, but would allow air into the HHO area.

have fun
–dick

Congratulations on your new apples-to-apples results!

The consistency of your Cal-to-RedDeer results help support that other factors are remaining steady.

Are you still running the two boosters in series?
What is your (approximate) Hydroxy liters-per-minute (or hour) production rate?

For the curiosity factor, you might measure the before-long-trip and immediately-after-long-trip (caution: it’s hot in there) current usage of the system.

On the tank-to-tank, I would hope that the Shell station had a consistent metered pump… if not, your local Bureau of Weights and Measures (those folks who put the “tested this year” stickers on the pumps) would be highly interested….

Folks attempting to -precisely- measure their Sprinter’s fuel consumption fill until it’s -just- visible through the filler pipe. If you’re going to get back on the highway -immediately-, you could even fill to the top of the neck (i don’t recommend that).

have fun
–dick

Thank you Dick for your encouraging words! No, I did not run two cells in series in that test (the table heading says that).

Yes, it is a good idea to measure the cell amperage before and after a long trip - will remember to do that next time.

Ooops, I did fill right to the top of the neck! Next time I will give it more room

Speed? I used the cruise control to maintain 120 KM/hour as much as I was allowed for the testing. My van is heavily loaded - almost reaching the maximum capacity. My van is 140″ wheelbase, high roof and 2.7L diesel engine.

[...] The tests on SL50 oxy hydrogen generator on our 2006 Dodge Sprinter cargo van (medium-long wheelbase with high roof) has almost come to an end - we just need to do one last test to confirm our recent result of 31% fuel saving. [...]

Did another test with HHO generator ON all the time for my recent trip to Edmonton on September 23 and 24. The worse thing occurred: the air induction hose, where I drilled two holes and then sealed up with rubber and clamps, leaked. It got worse on highway as the air pressure in the hose was higher than city driving. For that reason, the city driving fuel consumption within Edmonton (10.3 L/100KM) was significantly lower than the highway consumption (12.4 L/100KM) - usually it is the other around. No choice - I need to purchase a new air induction hose and do another test with SL50 before the HydroxyTech’s kit arrives.

Hmmm… I suspect that the VMU (vehicle management unit) made by HydroxyTech is the additional ECU (electronic control unit) that you are talking about. I am looking forward to receiving the kit I ordered from HydroxyTech which includes the VMU.

I think that the VMU is better for gas than for diesel - maybe it is better to use the sensor of presion of the injection bomb like in the “Evry fuel mod” - it uses a potentiometer for injecting more diesel.

See links:
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=12165&highlight=evry+mod
and
http://www.clubclio.com/public/foro/viewtopic.php?t=7456&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=potenciar&start=15 (in spanish for common rail)

My idea is, that may be used for reducing the diesel injected. (Is only theory, no probed).

I think about that additional ECU before changing this parameter.

Technical guide: http://www.dieselpowertuning.co.uk/files/dpt_technical_guide.pdf